1. I had been thinking Ben was most likely in the coffin for most of this season before this evening ... with Locke, and, to a lesser extent, Michael, as possibilities. But Ben seemed too obvious as tonight's story unfolded - everything that he did made us want to hate him more, and we already knew he was off the island. So I began thinking Locke again. Still and all, I can't quite see why Kate would have such disdain for Locke (in contrast to Ben). On yet another hand, there's Jeremy Bentham and John Locke both being names of philosophers.
2. Where did the island move? No need to think it moved in space. Much more intriguing to think it moved in time - maybe to somewhere in the near future, where it will reappear in Season 5 or 6. (Time travel is becoming increasingly central to Lost - with Desmond's mental projection through time, the island and the ship being in different times this season, and now perhaps the island moving into the future.)
3. I'm thinking Jin survived the massive explosion on the boat. He was on the deck, and could have jumped into the water. (Unlike Michael, whose time had clearly come, as indicated by Christian.) Jin could have survived in the water, until some other boat picked him up.
4. It was great to see Desmond and Penny together. Their happiness is by no means assured, however, with Ben out to kill Penny.
5. Is Sun really going to be working with Widmore? I doubt it - I'd say she's infiltrating his organization.
6. Back to Locke in the coffin: If he's taken back the island, he will likely end up not dead. Indeed, dying - if he did commit suicide - may have been part of his plan to help get the Oceanic Six back home...
We'll see next year...
And presumably, Boone, Libby, and Charlie will have some role ... They were mentioned as three who survived the crash of Oceanic 815, but didn't make it, in the expanded press conference with Jack talking tonight. Charlie makes sense - he recently died, and his body might be floating somewhere. But why Boone and Libby?
1. Lost's Back Full Paradoxical Blast 4.1 ... 4.2: Five Flashbacks and Three Rational Explanations ... 4.3: Thirty Minutes and Big Ben ... 4.4: Kate and ... ... 4.5 Desmond 1 and Desmond 2 ... 4.6 The True Nature of Ben ... 4.7 Flash Both Ways ... 4.8 Michael and Alex ... 4.9 Daughters, Rules, and Some Truth about Ben ... 4.10 Almost a Dream Come True ... 4.11 Unlocking Locke ... 4.12 Hurley's Numbers on the Dashboard
and
2. More Thoughts On Lost 4.1: Those Who Went with Hurley and Those Who Stayed with Jack and Two More Points about Lost 4.1
additional discussion of the Season 4 finale of Lost in 10-minute podcast
The Plot to Save Socrates
"a Da Vinci-esque thriller" - New York Daily News
"Sierra Waters is sexy as hell" - curled up with a good book
more about The Plot to Save Socrates and its time travel ...
Read the first chapter of The Plot to Save Socrates .... FREE!
24 comments:
Interesting idea about Jin surviving, but wouldn't he have made it back to his wife, at least before the baby was born?
Not if Widmore's people picked him, and are holding him captive (which Sun may have found out about recently....)
Geez you didn't even mention seeing Walt all grown up and handsome with a manly deep voice.
You're right, candalous - it was a wonderful touch and great to see ... thanks for mentioning it ... (it was significant that Walt thinks his father is still alive)...
okay so my first thought is that it was reported yesterday that 3 original cast members would die, that to me would be michael, locke seeing he's in a coffin and I assume Jin. You know I'll have more to say soon as will you
I also thought it was going to be Ben in the coffin but as the episode went on my family kept saying that it was too obvious. So because Jeremy Bentham and John Locke were both English Philosophers, I did think it might be Locke. But good call about using the suicide to get back to the Island, didn't think of that.
I don't think the mentioning of Boone, Libby or Charlie meant anything. I think Jack just made those names up for the story, maybe so they could talk about them as they met them and knew them.
Don't know what to think about Jin.
I wrote a blog post also listing all my thoughts from the finale, longer list, but shorter thoughts at http://connectwithyourteens.blogspot.com/2008/05/lost-season-4-finale.html
if anyone interested
Hi Paul!
In all, I thought this was a great finale. The actors are incredibly talented and the writers keep me on the edge of my couch. I did expect a more horrendous escape from the island, though. With all of the lead in, with Kate saying she's tried to forget the horrible events for three years, I expected something more apocalyptic. Do the viewers really know everything that happened on that day yet?
Some other random thoughts:
Locke – I expected to see him in the coffin however I don't believe that he committed suicide. I think he was killed by the man who keeps popping up – I forget his name (he visited Hurley, stating he was from Oceanic Airlines and he was the one who told Locke to take the survivalist journey in the first place). I think Locke probably knew that death was inevitable and accepted it, perhaps sacrificing himself in an attempt to get the others to return. With that said, I tend to think that time travel will be a factor and that Locke isn't really dead (someone, Richard maybe, went back in time to rescue him).
Jin – I agree with you and think he is alive. The camera didn’t cut to Jin on the freighter immediately before the explosion and I think that’s because he jumped ship (there were life jackets in his vicinity). I think he survived and swam back to the island before it was moved.
Miles (AKA "Shorty") – he can see dead people *and* is physic (his premonition about Charlotte - "After all the time you spent trying to get back here ... what do I mean")? This character is intriguing as is the mystery that surrounds Charlotte.
Ben – I deplore this character but LOVE Michael Emmerson! His facial expressions are just amazing and I love his banter with Terry O'Quinn's Locke. I hate Ben but I love to see him on screen! Who else but Michael Emmerson could deliver the line "if you mean time traveling bunnies, the answer is yes" in such a matter-of-fact manner? That whole scene between Ben & Locke was priceless as is every scene Michael Emmerson acts in, to be honest.
Hurley – why did he give Walt hope that his dad is alive? Clearly, the survivors (Hurley included) don't think Michael survived the freighter explosion. They declared Jin dead, why not Michael who was on the same freighter with Jin?
"Check mate, Mr. Eko” – I didn’t see that coming.
Sawyer's sacrifice in the helicopter – Josh Holloway wasn't in this season nearly enough and it was touching to watch Sawyer step up in an attempt to save the others. Did anyone else catch the chemistry between Sawyer and Juliet?
Christian has become the angel of death? Huh?
Kate’s premonition about Claire – Claire was wearing the same outfit she was in when she walked into the jungle with her dead dad – is that relevant? I mean, Christian seems to always be wearing a change of clothes. Also, what changed with Claire and Aaron's importance to the island? Weren't she and Aaron supoosed to stay together or else? I still wonder why the plan changed; why did Christian take Claire away from her son? Also, why did Kate apologize to Aaron? Is there something else we don’t know about the day they were rescued?
Sun – blames Jack for what? Jin’s death? Leaving Jin behind? Something he did after their return? I am very curious to see what happens with Sun and predict that she will be a force to be reckoned with.
“Everyone” must return to the island – does that mean Walt, too?
This show is fabulous and, unlike my other favorite show MOONLIGHT, will be back next season. I can't wait for the return of LOST!
When Locke was watching the Darma video, didn't it say something about moving an object a certain amount of time into the future, BUT for a few moments it would appear as though it wasn't there anymore? I could be remembering wrong, but I assumed that is what was happening with the island.
Also, Hurley stated that he has conversations with dead people. The fact that he gave Walt hope that Michael is still alive is probably because he hasn't had a conversation with Michael.
Locke in the coffin doesn't make me think he's actually dead. Like Dr. Levinson pointed out earlier, space and time are becoming larger players in Lost week by week. Let's not forget we've also seen "Christian" dead in a coffin as well at some point in the past.
On a side, I loved the shout out to Mr. Eko, my favorite fallen Lost-er.
I wonder what happened to Daniel Faraday and the people on the boat with him. Will he be able to swim back to the island? Or is he lost somewhere out in the ocean without an island and without a boat?
I don't understand why Kate hates Locke so much that she wouldn't be expected at his funeral either. That doesn't make any sense to me.
Also, Jin is one of my favorite characters, and I'm pretty upset at being manipulated and left hanging over whether he may or may not be dead twice in one season. I don't know if I'm in a minority having Jin and Sun as favorite characters ... but you can only manipulate fans' emotions so much before they max out and stop caring about the show. I'm feeling a little spent on the drama.
Great comments, folks -
Jennifer - I'll definitely read your post when I have a few minutes tonight.
Traci - excellent questions -
"With all of the lead in, with Kate saying she's tried to forget the horrible events for three years, I expected something more apocalyptic. Do the viewers really know everything that happened on that day yet?"
No, I think we don't know everything yet. But, as far as the apocalypse - the boating blowing up, the island disappearing, Sawyer may have drowned (from Kate's perspective) ... that's pretty bad...
"I tend to think that time travel will be a factor and that Locke isn't really dead (someone, Richard maybe, went back in time to rescue him)."
Agreed!
"Sawyer's sacrifice in the helicopter – Josh Holloway wasn't in this season nearly enough and it was touching to watch Sawyer step up in an attempt to save the others. Did anyone else catch the chemistry between Sawyer and Juliet?"
I loved Sawyer's heroism this season. Yeah, I caught that chemistry ... should be interesting on the island next season...
"“Everyone” must return to the island – does that mean Walt, too?"
Would have to be...
But would Desmond? Or, does the "everyone" mean everyone ever on the island and in association with the Losties, or just the Losties?
Jessica - Faraday's boat is likely in the same time-frame as the island...
When I saw Locke in the coffin, at first I thought he was Jack and Claire's father. (I'm not used to seeing Locke all cleaned up and shaved.) That would have been quite interesting. Imagine Jack having to return to the island, accompanying his father's (twice-dead) body on a plane as before.
okay , heres my theory so far, when Ben landed in the desert with the jacket on it was 10 months later then when the island was. I think the island might have traveled 10 months into the future. what do you think? How great was Rose in this episode even if it was only 2 lines they were brillant. I think the writers out did themselves. More later
Dawn - works for me!
Tracy - sorry for spelling your name Traci - I'm the world's worst speller...
There has to be more to "the last day" Even if Kate doesn't know Sawyer made it, and thinks Jin is dead...it seems far fetched that she would pin either of those things on Lock.
I am assuming Lock was going by Jeremy (besides for literary reasons) because he was suppose to be part of the O15 that didn't make it so needed an alias, but it was weird that everyone used it so definitively with each other, when they had known him as John
Hey thanks whoever made the catch about time travel making the item seem to disappear for a moment...because I thought too, if it is moving in time, wouldn't it still be there in space.
Also the Desmond time travel thing still bugs me. It is hard to compare his to the islands or anyone elses, because he never physically left,
It was a good one!
Dawn—not only was Ben wearing the same jacket when he landed in the desert, he had the same cut on his upper arm, remember the one he got when he fell down the ladder climbing down into the chamber with the "frozen donkey wheel."
And remember he had no idea "When" he landed, he had to ask
Jessica and Sophie - 100% right.
On the subject of Ben, I liked how he was consistently uncaring about the lives of anyone in the finale. Ben's a true Hitchcockian villain... (see Hitchcock's Strangers on a Train, for example, for an erudite villain who was bad through and through)
Or perhaps Ben simply realized that they were so far underground that there was no way the transmitter could still send a signal to the bomb on the boat. (Of course it did, but Ben had no way of knowing that the writers had created a magic transmitter.)
Ha - good possible point, Tvindy - but I prefer to think that the signal got through, even though it was deep underground, because the weird time effects surrounding the island somehow strengthened the signal...
LOL tvindy on the transmitter! Whenever I make a point like that with this show (which usually involves questions in the hygene catagory, ie, about great looking nails, no armpit or leg hair, all while living off the land. etc) My 19 year old daughter always says, "really Mom? that's the part you're having trouble buying?"
Having said that...they didn't send the elevator back up, (why would they) so how did transmitter boy get down there at all, or so fast relative to how long it took them? (good homor in that scene by the way...'How far down is this?")
And I would never lessen Ben's character by suggesting he is any less evil than we like him to be but...
Maybe he's been to the future, and knows who makes it off the boat, so it's no big deal! Or he knows the island will only let people die who are suppose to die. Whole paradigm shift when you act thinking the "good guys" can't die.
In fact maybe that's "the rule" that Widmore changed. He figured out a way that Ben's daughter could die, even though the island wasn't suppose to let that happen
Paul: I caught the tail end of Friday night's spelling bee contest on ABC and the next to last word was an obscure one (aren't they all) -- "prosopopoeia." The word means "a figure of speech in which an imaginary, absent or deceased person is represented as speaking or acting." I immediately thought of Jacob from Lost, the Wizard of Oz-like puppet master character who seems to be controlling things from really behind-the-scenes (like another dimension or nether world).
/jimy_max
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